THE ROADS WE'VE TRAVELED -- Interview with Ella Torrey
What do you remember about the Depression?
The depression, we knew about it one, because a lot of our families and friends were not having as good a time as we were having and I remember--we lived about a mile from the railroad track--and I remember the hobos coming all the time to the back door to the kitchen and going out and seeing them all having soup and being fed. They were always fed, and I remember my father saying that one night he was talking at the dinner table about a friend that had committed suicide by jumping out of the window in Wall Street. And I didn't really know what it meant but I knew it was a hard time for everybody.
What was expected from a date? How and when did you first learn about sex?
My mother always used to say that you don't owe a boy anything but a good time. If I had promised to go to a debutante party--which we did those things--with a nerd and then someone better called, she would never let me switch. Or have a late date. We didn't sleep with these dates. It just wasn't there. This is really before birth control was well known. There was certainly birth control available, but certainly we didn't know about it. And what we did was I guess was a goodnight kiss and some mild experimentation. What we used to say was "above the belt," which was a term that was commonly used in those days. Yet my mother, I still remember her saying to me one time, "Now if you ever get into trouble, I might be angry but I want you to tell me and I will help you." I remember that but I also remember--I was about fourteen and I didn't quite know what she was talking about.
What do you remember of World War II? What was your experience during the War?
I was a junior in high school and I can still remember listening to President Roosevelt announce that the Japanese had attacked Pearl Harbor. It was December 7th, 1941, Sunday. My brother who was two years older than I was shot down trying to rescue a buddy who had disappeared into the Pacific. He was listed as Missing In Action and declared dead at the end of the war and received the Distinguished Flying Cross posthumously. It was devastating to my family but I once asked my father how he had coped and he said, well, he had been too young for World War I and too old for World War II, and he gained great comfort from knowing that his son had died fighting for his country. I still remember in 1945 when the War was over. It was a time of tremendous hopefulness. People really felt that the great war had been fought and the United Nations was going to change a lot of things. And it's certainly what I thought. I mean basically I went into international work because I had lost a brother in a war. And I knew what it meant. And I still see all these pictures of the refugees and the Kosovos and people like that and I just think about what these families, what is happening. My father used to say to me, "I fought for the League of Nations, now you fight for the United Nations."
Describe your education. What were your professional ambitions? What was it like for women in the professional workforce?
I was a very mediocre student and went to Bennington because I didn't have to take exams or do anything like that, so I majored in English. And then I went to Europe. Then I came back and joined the UN and my first assignment was to work with Eleanor Roosevelt. And that was just unbelievable. I mean you know, I remember some nights she used to say to me, "Ella would you like to come down and have supper with me at the end of the day?" I'd say, "Oh no Mrs. Roosevelt, I have a date tonight."
And I lived with a group of women in New York. One was a dress designer. Once was a budding doctor. And the budding doctor probably had more troubles than any of the rest of us because she was immediately slotted to become a pediatrician and she didn't want to became a pediatrician and became a gastroenterologist, but uh--I saw being slotted into. And I saw women leave the work force and get married, many of them unable to stay in their jobs. In those days, if you got pregnant you were out of a job. And they didn't really expect you to come back. Maybe you did but there was no maternity leave that I ever heard of. I got married at twenty-nine. And I walked down the aisle by myself. I said--my father had died but my brother was around--I just couldn't believe anybody could give somebody away. I said, nobody's going to give me away. So I walked down the aisle saying to myself, well if I don't like it, I can get a divorce. I love my job, I love my work, but I also loved the guy I married and stayed married to him for forty-five years. But I said to him in the beginning, I said, "You know, I'm always going to work." That was fine with him. I think he enjoyed it. I worked when my kids were little, not full time all the time, but I worked. My husband and I raised four children--two boys and two girls--first in Indiana and then in Philadelphia, and we lived to celebrate grandchildren and had the fun of traveling together before my husband's death about eight, nine months ago.
What has changed in your lifetime regarding women's rights?
I think in United States we have anti-feminism which really does bother me. I think it's strong. I think, I'm disappointed that as few women have run as have, and have as hard a time as they do. I thought many more women would be involved in politics. Of course one of the things that women don't do, and they don't perhaps get the opportunity to, is keep on trying. You'll see a man try for office and then he doesn't make it and he'll try for the next year. But women don't do that I think. I'd never took sports much, but I've watched nieces and other women who participate in sports, and strong sports, and I think Title IX was a great thing because it's made women far more active. And I think that from sports, and I never thought I'd say this--I was on the seventh team, if there were seven teams, I was on the bottom team in high school-- but I think women's sports have taught women a lot about competition and winning and losing. That's a plus.
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